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Heroes: Season Three
G-Man
post Oct 11 2008, 06:58 PM
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Eric....loved your latest "Watching the Eclipse" column. It's interesting to see where we agree ( Hiro's current storyline) and where we disagree (Daphine.....you want to marry her... I want to go to her funeral.)

But niether viewpoints negate the fact that we're both fans of the series...or the fact your column is very well written....loved the comments about "What's his name....that one guy." and agree that the future version of Mohinder was creepy. Reading this thing is almost more fun than watching the show itself.

Loved the Sylar future story (thought I would hate it when they showed the teaser last week) and the return of Adam...had to happen...he's such an interesting character. But now we have three of the series bad guys...actually turning out to be good guys (I'm counting Linderman), but I guess he could still turn out to be a bad guy, although Nathan is beginning to think he's an angel.

Another character M.I.A.....what happened to Claire's flying boyfriend? And speaking of flying...you're dead on as far as those visuals are concerned as of late. Did the Heroes FX budget get slashed....as well as Smallville's?

I'm concerned the current story is not only making your head hurt as far as the time travel aspects go....although I touch time travel plots in my material a lot I still get a little cornfuzed at times......Heroes does force you to pay attention to every little detail. (As does Fringe). You seem to pick up on more of them then I do....totally missed that Sylar was wearing a version of Noah's glasses.

As been a proven fact with comics, and movies...80% of the audience doesn't like to be "forced" to think. They want NASCAR level entertainment....where everything goes around in circles...over and over....easy to follow...even the "unexpected" is expected. movies and t.v shows that make you think...usually find it hard to maintain an audience. (anybody "Daybreak" with Taye Diggs? Loved that show...guess I was the only one.)

Heroes is droping viewers like flies in the town I live in and surrounding communities...as "Comic Shop" talk seems to be focused on more more people quoting "I'm fed up with that show." on a weekly basis. I know three people in my life on an almost daily basis....who loved the show during season one...who loathe the show now and avoid it like A.I.G. stock.

But somewhere out there some one is STILL watching it.....let's hope it's more than just the two of us.


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doombug
post Oct 11 2008, 08:03 PM
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QUOTE (G-Man @ Oct 10 2008, 06:31 PM) *
Sounds good.....your Heroes column is one of my favorite features here on the site!

Aww thank you sir, are you going to be with us at New York in february?


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G-Man
post Oct 11 2008, 08:14 PM
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Feb.?

New York??

Is that New York Con?


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doombug
post Oct 12 2008, 12:24 AM
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QUOTE (G-Man @ Oct 11 2008, 10:14 PM) *
Feb.?

New York??

Is that New York Con?

Indeed, I'll respond to your big thing in a minute, was curious if you shall be there with me, Chuck and Russell?


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doombug
post Oct 12 2008, 12:32 AM
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QUOTE (G-Man @ Oct 11 2008, 08:58 PM) *


Eric....loved your latest "Watching the Eclipse" column. It's interesting to see where we agree ( Hiro's current storyline) and where we disagree (Daphine.....you want to marry her... I want to go to her funeral.)

But niether viewpoints negate the fact that we're both fans of the series...or the fact your column is very well written....loved the comments about "What's his name....that one guy." and agree that the future version of Mohinder was creepy. Reading this thing is almost more fun than watching the show itself.

Loved the Sylar future story (thought I would hate it when they showed the teaser last week) and the return of Adam...had to happen...he's such an interesting character. But now we have three of the series bad guys...actually turning out to be good guys (I'm counting Linderman), but I guess he could still turn out to be a bad guy, although Nathan is beginning to think he's an angel.

Another character M.I.A.....what happened to Claire's flying boyfriend? And speaking of flying...you're dead on as far as those visuals are concerned as of late. Did the Heroes FX budget get slashed....as well as Smallville's?

I'm concerned the current story is not only making your head hurt as far as the time travel aspects go....although I touch time travel plots in my material a lot I still get a little cornfuzed at times......Heroes does force you to pay attention to every little detail. (As does Fringe). You seem to pick up on more of them then I do....totally missed that Sylar was wearing a version of Noah's glasses.

As been a proven fact with comics, and movies...80% of the audience doesn't like to be "forced" to think. They want NASCAR level entertainment....where everything goes around in circles...over and over....easy to follow...even the "unexpected" is expected. movies and t.v shows that make you think...usually find it hard to maintain an audience. (anybody "Daybreak" with Taye Diggs? Loved that show...guess I was the only one.)

Heroes is droping viewers like flies in the town I live in and surrounding communities...as "Comic Shop" talk seems to be focused on more more people quoting "I'm fed up with that show." on a weekly basis. I know three people in my life on an almost daily basis....who loved the show during season one...who loathe the show now and avoid it like A.I.G. stock.

But somewhere out there some one is STILL watching it.....let's hope it's more than just the two of us.

I think this weeks episode I'll hopefully be geared towards jokes again, I flat out miss certain aspects of the show.

Linderman is in no way a good guy, the actor Malcolm Macdowell is probably one of the best actors of all time, but his character is very very sinister. Just wait and see, I'm predicting a huge pay off.

Adam being our only hope? I dig that, the character has his moments. And the third sister's destructive powers are a very very bad sign, I'm predicting she turns by the end of this volume.

And if there is a core audience, the show does stay. The network is fully behind it. Just like DC with Blue Beetle.


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G-Man
post Oct 12 2008, 07:01 AM
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I would love to be in New York this Febuary to help Comic Related cover the con.....you, Chuck, and Russ....that's a killer line up right there. But right now it's difficult for me to see that far into the future. There's a lot of things working in favor of being able to attend, but just as many against.

Hopefully the dust begins to settle soon. You, Russ...and Ron are three people I want to meet just as much as any comic celerbity out there. I love "Talking" with you guys here at the site (and Glen Davis.....he seems real cool too).
To not only meet you guys but work with you covering one the biggest cons in the nation..in one of the biggest cities in the world.

Dude.

The chances of my daugther actually being in the New York area are much better. She's on the verge of being accepted for an internship at Marvel Comics....that fact would help me score the trip because I could combine visiting with her as reasons to go. If accepted she'll be at the Marvel offices for spring and summer quarters 2009. We'll find out something....Dec 19th (I think)

She wants to follow in Chris Claremont's footsteps.

Anyway......back on topic.

If the show's premiere special/countdown that aired an hour before the premiere of season three is any type of indication.....yes there is still a very viable core group of Heroes fans out there and I don't see any problems for the show on N.B.C. any time soon. I don't have the actual facts to back this up....but I think nation wide ratings on the show are down slightly than what was expected....but still doing much better than most. I see the show sticking around a couple more years at least....it's number one obstacle in it's ability to stick around for the long term would be how well the writing staff manages to keep the stories fresh, intelligent and entertaining.

And in all honesty....I really don't think the viewing habits of a handful of a few disgruntled veiwers in Springfield/Fairborn Ohio really has that big of an impact on the overall big picture.

If it did....we would all still be watching Birds of Prey...now in it's 6th season....and Charmed,

See.....some people like the stuff that doesn't make them think. Thankfully somebody came to their senses as far as those shows are concerned.


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doombug
post Oct 12 2008, 01:26 PM
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Ah Birds of Prey, how much you weren't like your comic counterpart. tongue.gif At least we got to see batman and the joker once! And it was in continuity with smallville apparently. Such a trainwreck though.

Charmed wasn't that bad until its last 3 season, then it got bad. Hell any show with a guest appearance by Bruce Campbell has to be good right?

And hopefully your daughter gets the internship sir and hopefully its all Claremont she wants to be like and not current claremont. Notice how in my Why I love Comics I have not mentioned new exiles at all? Well actually I think I did once, I really don't have anything nice to say about the book. sad.gif


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ChuckMoore
post Oct 12 2008, 03:33 PM
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QUOTE (G-Man @ Oct 10 2008, 05:31 PM) *
Sounds good.....your Heroes column is one of my favorite features here on the site!


...and now it comes with the FULL EPISODE interweaved with the story each week (thanks to Hulu.com and NBC). Check out the latest installment here.


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doombug
post Oct 12 2008, 09:41 PM
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QUOTE (ChuckMoore @ Oct 12 2008, 05:33 PM) *
...and now it comes with the FULL EPISODE interweaved with the story each week (thanks to Hulu.com and NBC). Check out the latest installment here.

Heh I was actually going to start tomorrow nights column with that...well not that exactly but, I'll still do something. wink.gif


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G-Man
post Oct 13 2008, 08:23 PM
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Okay....Heroes Season Three continues....tonight's episode.

Wow.

This is the show I remember and fell in love with. Revelation after revelation that begins to tie everything together.

Great characterization.....intense turning points in the lives of the older characters....and a couple of interesting new ones as well.

Eric is going to have his hands full covering this one and I'm betting he's already chomping at the bit. Can't blame him. This episode didn't have anything about it that I didn't like. I thought the first eight minutes was some of the most intense moments of the series so far....until the next eight...and the ten that followed that.

That's exactly how this installment played out.

I didn't even mind the Angela Petrilli, Hiro, Maya....or Speed Freak plotlines.

I'm going to shoot a few more teasers your way...like the secret of Linderman is revealed....(Very nice touch. I like that.)

We learn the name of....that one guy who we don't know the name of......

Mohinder....goes Moribus...in a way.

Next week's episode looks just as good.

It's all yours Mr. Ratcliffe.....Knock Em' Dead Kid.

(and remember if you want them to stay dead you have to wedge something sharp into the base of their skull just below the left ear.) wink.gif


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G-Man
post Oct 14 2008, 09:12 AM
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Entertainment Weekly recently ran a rather "stunning" bit of news stating that NBC is extremly concerned with "millions of Heroes viewers...almost three million viewers... who have appeared to literally vanish off the face of the Earth."

Shocking news. I had heard rumblings on the internet about how viewership for the show had dropped this season...but had no idea it was this drastic.

NBC is waiting with fingers crossed that the rating numbers from last night shows some sign that the bleeding has stopped...and even very optimisitcally hoping for signs of improvement.



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doombug
post Oct 14 2008, 01:47 PM
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QUOTE (G-Man @ Oct 13 2008, 10:23 PM) *



Okay....Heroes Season Three continues....tonight's episode.

Wow.

This is the show I remember and fell in love with. Revelation after revelation that begins to tie everything together.

Great characterization.....intense turning points in the lives of the older characters....and a couple of interesting new ones as well.

Eric is going to have his hands full covering this one and I'm betting he's already chomping at the bit. Can't blame him. This episode didn't have anything about it that I didn't like. I thought the first eight minutes was some of the most intense moments of the series so far....until the next eight...and the ten that followed that.

That's exactly how this installment played out.

I didn't even mind the Angela Petrilli, Hiro, Maya....or Speed Freak plotlines.

I'm going to shoot a few more teasers your way...like the secret of Linderman is revealed....(Very nice touch. I like that.)

We learn the name of....that one guy who we don't know the name of......

Mohinder....goes Moribus...in a way.

Next week's episode looks just as good.

It's all yours Mr. Ratcliffe.....Knock Em' Dead Kid.

(and remember if you want them to stay dead you have to wedge something sharp into the base of their skull just below the left ear.) wink.gif

I'm actually still in shock, so much shock that this week's edition managed to stay mostly spoiler free for fear that I felt people needed to see this one, especially if they were long time viewers of the show.

But hey: We are getting a superteam! tongue.gif wink.gif


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G-Man
post Oct 20 2008, 08:19 PM
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One thing's for sure....watching tonight's episode of Heroes was a lot like playing Russian Roulette...in more ways than one.

Most of the cast members who annoyed me to no end last week....stole the show this week. Yes...that includes Hiro, Ando, Daphine, Parkman and even Merideth.

Hard to believe.

A lot of laughs in this episode...and most coming from the Hiro and Ando storyline...but it worked this week. One thing that almost made me laugh out loud and it wasn't supposed to....Peter Petrilli flying looked more like Peter Pan. What's going on with the special effects on this show.

The Mohinder, Nathan , and Tracy scene also had some very cheezy fx as well.

Sylar and Noah...who usually hold this show together....were not as strong this time around. Sylar and Peter...disappointing....Peter has really become brain dead of late...he screws up more stuff than Hiro.

The conclusion of the "Puppet Master" scene with Claire and her two moms was pretty cool.

And one of my favorite characters seems to have "bit the dust" tonight. That's not right.

I did notice something tonight, another X-Men link I never noticed before....Sylar's real name being Gabriel....just like the "evil" brother that Scott and Alex Summers learned about recently. Now Peter and Nathan are following in their footsteps.

But Peter, Nathan, and Gabriel's dad ain't no space pirate.


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doombug
post Oct 23 2008, 01:39 PM
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It would be cool if he was a space pirate, but I think that would turn viewers off. wink.gif

Seriously though, that chart is wrong as most of the people on the chart are good guys.


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G-Man
post Oct 23 2008, 02:02 PM
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Yeah...just a tad bit decieving.


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G-Man
post Oct 27 2008, 08:30 PM
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After two very good episodes of Heroes in two weeks it was to expected that the show would slow down just enough to collect it's breath. This episode felt transitional....moving the storyline just enough to set up what appears to a very revealing episode in....two weeks. (First Fringe...now Heroes too?!)

But one thing I learned over the last couple of years is even a sub-par episode of Heroes is better than most stuff on T.V.

There were a lot of things about this show that just failed to keep the quality on the same level of the last two.One thing that did stay the same...any object flying through the air this season....just looks plain ridicolous. There was a time when the special effects on Heroes was something that generated a lot of attention. I guess it still does , but for all the wrong reasons.

I'm not a big fan of Arthur Petrilli...but I can understand his feelings towards Angela...who literally makes my skin crawl. Matt and Daphine's confrontation with Nox was see through and very predictable, but the secondary reveal with Daphine's phone call to Arthur caught me off guard...(but I don't see how her secret mission is working when Matt can read her mind).

There was an awkward "Jerry Springer" moment in Mohinder's lab that was pretty funny involving Claire, Nathan, Tracy, Meredith, and Noah....and I like the whole "Fire and Ice" symbology with Nathan caught in the middle.

Other than that....Peter gets grounded, Claire and Elle realize they really don't like holding hands, and Hiro learns that Hyenna dung should only be eaten in small portions.

Thankfully Sylar had a few good scenes....loved the "terminal velocity" incident.


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G-Man
post Oct 28 2008, 04:08 PM
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The only thing that seems to be falling quicker than the nation's consumer confidence (at the lowest it has been since before I was born)....is the popularity and ratings of Heroes.

I was floored by the the multiple news stories that broke taday about the televison show and it's current downward spiral......

From Yahoo News.



"Heroes" was an instant hit back in the Fall of 2006, captivating fanboys as well as the general public with its ‘”Save the Cheerleader, Save the World” catchphrase that had everyone buzzing. But then something went terribly wrong, and Season 2 pretty much tanked from the start. The storylines were fractured, the heroes we cared about weren’t together onscreen enough, and we got a whole bunch of new characters we didn’t care about. The introduction of the terrible twosome (twins Maya and Alejandro) and their endless journey to get to the United States was when “Heroes” jumped the shark -- and even with Alejandro gone, we still have Maya around to remind us of a great show gone bad.


From Entertainment Weekly.


'Heroes' Creator Apologizes to Fans
Tim Kring admits mistakes were made at the beginning of season 2, but promises to get back on track
More



''In retrospect, I don't think romance is a natural fit for us,'' says Kring of the love stories starring Claire and Hiro.

By Jeff Jensen Jeff Jensen

Jeff Jensen, an EW senior writer, has been despondent since the cancellation of ''Twin Peaks''On the chilly Monday morning that Hollywood's writers went on strike, Heroes creator Tim Kring called from the streets outside the Hollywood studio where his NBC series is shot. ''Yes, I'm picketing my own show,'' says the 50-year-old writer-producer. ''So surreal.''

But Kring wasn't calling to discuss labor woes — he was calling to explain why Heroes, suffering a creative decline and a 15 percent ratings drop from the same period last year, went from Human Torch hot to Iceman cold. The good news? A turnaround appears to be under way. After weeks of sluggish storytelling, the Nov. 5 episode recaptured some of last season's fanciful energy. We've also seen the next two episodes — and we like them, too. The cliff-hangers are back. Narrative purpose has been discovered. Old favorites like Peter (Milo Ventimiglia) and Horn-Rimmed Glasses (Jack Coleman) take center stage. Even more encouraging: Kring himself is keenly aware that Heroes is broken. Here's his candid critique:

THE PACE IS TOO SLOW ''We assumed the audience wanted season 1 — a buildup of intrigue about these characters and the discovery of their powers. We taught [them] to expect a certain kind of storytelling. They wanted adrenaline. We made a mistake.''

THE WORLD-SAVING STAKES SHOULD HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED SOONER The premonition of nuclear apocalypse created a larger context that unified every story line last season. Kring now sees that Volume 2 (the first 11 episodes of season 2) would have been better served if Peter's vision of viral Armageddon had appeared in the season premiere rather than episode 7. ''We took too long to get to the big-picture story,'' he says.

THE ROOKIES DIDN'T GREET THEMSELVES PROPERLY New Heroes Monica (Dana Davis), Maya (Dania Ramirez), and Alejandro (Shalim Ortiz) ''shouldn't have been introduced in separate story lines that felt unattached to the show. The way we introduced Elle (Kristen Bell) — by weaving her in via Peter's story line — is a more logical way to bring new characters into the show.'' (That said, Kring says a few newbies won't make it beyond this second volume, which wraps Dec. 3.)

HIRO WAS IN JAPAN WAY TOO LONG Hiro's (Masi Oka) time-bending adventure in 17th-century Japan — where he mentored samurai hero Takezo Kensei (David Anders) — finally came to an end on Nov. 5. But Kring says it ''should have [lasted] three episodes. We didn't give the audience enough story to justify the time we allotted it.''

YOUNG LOVE STINKS Kring regrets sticking Claire (Hayden Panettiere) with a super-dud boyfriend and forcing Hiro to moon over a cutesy princess. ''I've seen more convincing romances on TV,'' he admits. ''In retrospect, I don't think romance is a natural fit for us.''

Yet while Heroes has finally found some dramatic traction, this second volume is pretty much a wash. The Dec. 3 episode has been retooled to function as a potential season finale — a move inspired by the writers' strike and a desire to give the show ''a clean slate'' when it goes back into production for Volume 3. At that point, Kring wants to craft a rebooted Heroes that can attract new fans and win back those who've tuned out: ''The message is that we've heard the complaints — and we're doing something about it.''

Even Fake Stan had something to say about the "Fallen Heroes"



HEROES IN RATINGS SLUMP: ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY SUGGESTS SOME FIXES

ITEM! It seems that my favorite TV show this side of Who Wants To Be a Superhero is experiencing a ratings slump of late, and Entertainment Weekly has suggested some solutions in it's cover story Heroes: Five Ways to Fix a Series In Crisis. Everyone’s entitled to their opposing opinion I suppose, but who are we kidding? Monday morning quarterbacking from Entertainment Weekly? I wonder how People Magazine or Tiger Beat would fix the series?Your Uncle Stanley used to go through this same dynamic with my publisher/uncle-in-law Martin Goodman. You know why Uncle Marty never wrote comics? For the same reason the writers of EW aren’t producing quality network TV shows — because they can’t. You know the old saying, “Those who can, do. Those who can’t become Hollywood flacks.”



Personally, Yours Truly still enjoys Heroes as must-see-Monday-night-TV. If the Smilin’ One was going to offer up any constructive criticism to show runner Tim Kring — from one sense-shattering serial scripter to another — it would just be to do some more stunt-casting cross-overs with A-list television and movie stars, like... I dunno... say the creator of the Marvel Universe and the elder statesman of all things hip, slick and cool?A certain bus-driving guest star from season one, episode 16 comes to mind. He could be revealed to actually be Grandfather Petrelli, the long-lost patriarch of the clan who has the ability of rapid ratings regeneration! He would need to have a couple of really hot, super-powered younger girlfriends, though, as back-up. Hey! I think I'm onto something here! I’ll have my people call your people! We’ll do lunch, okay?


Excelsior!

Smiley


I have to agree with "Stan the Man"....I still watch Heores and still like the show. As I mentioned last night even a bad episode of Heroes is better than 95% of the other options on television. I think what can hurt this show more than anything else are attempts at a quick fix.

Obviously the show generated a lot of fans in it's first season....a good number of those fine feather fans are now falling off the bandwagon...and I'm assuming the fans that are left understand the workings of comic story telling better than those who have gone to the way side.

I am concerned that the show will continue to generate negative press and the slump will worsen. My advice to the Heroes creators on staff.....the show isn't broken. Let things play out the way you have planned the real fans will still be there...don't worry about losing the guys who don't like the show anymore because Claire dosn't wear her cheerleader uniform or the girls who get "weirded out" by seeing Hayden and Milo as a real life couple and then as an uncle and niece on the show.


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G-Man
post Nov 3 2008, 08:14 AM
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In what appears to be an effort to stop the bleeding and the continued slide into the rating's basement....the powers that be over at the Heroes set has fired producers Jeph Loeb and Jesse Alexander, both of whom has been with the show since it's start.


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David O'Leary
post Nov 3 2008, 12:57 PM
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Is that a little drastic? I mean these guys know the ins and outs of the show and now someone has to come in and learn everything from scratch and try get this show back on the road.


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G-Man
post Nov 3 2008, 04:01 PM
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I think it's VERY drastic. The Heroes "rating watch" reminds me a lot of the current state of the stock market. A lot of over reaction and out right panic along with a lot of so called experts claiming they can fix the problem and instead just making it worse.

The problem is....I don't think there's that big of a problem. Shake the fake fans off....tell your story the way you had planned it. Satisfy your true demographic. There's enough fans out there to keep the show afloat...and eventually help it rise back up the rating ladder.

I still watch the show and I'm still entertained by it. I have no plans to stop watching it...until it ends which I hope is still a few years down the road. As I have already stated before....even when Heroes is off the mark it's a lot better than all the other stuff out there.

I'll take a bad episode of Heroes over a good episode of House, ER, CSI New York, Miami, Nebraska...and Desperate House Wives any day of the week and twice on Tuesday.



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