Rob Granito is putting the con artist in "con artist", He is ripping off other artists' work and claiming them as his own Options

[Mark Ellis]

If this guy had pulled this 20 or so years ago, I can sorta see him getting away with it...he would have been just one of a thousand wanna-bes and never-wases who could claim--some legitmately--they were working on projects from any number of independent companies or even Marvel and DC who were pumping out an enormous amount of product at the time.

But now?

I'm amazed he lasted as long as he did...and even more amazed the organizers of various conventions abetted him.

Just goes to show you that nerve can carry you places where talent and real credentials never can.

[David O'Leary]

Bill Watterson isn't dead. He's about 52 and lives in Cleveland with his wife, doing secret things as he declines all requests for interviews.

Thanks for letting me know. I had read in several areas that he had passed.

[David O'Leary]

I think w should be the first site other than bleeding cool to front page this.

On the front page right now is an article by myself on what has happened including comment from coimc pro's

http://comicrelated.com/news/11315/the-case-of-rob-granito

[ScottDMSimmons]

On the front page right now is an article by myself on what has happened including comment from coimc pro's

http://comicrelated.com/news/11315/the-case-of-rob-granito

David, thanks for helping present an angle from the viewpoint of some affected professionals.

[ScottDMSimmons]

Good opinion article by Jim MacQuarrie, focused on Granito's possible tactics of his stretching the truth.

http://www.tasteslikecomics.com/2011/03/do...uy-rob-granito/

This post has been edited by ScottDMSimmons: Mar 29 2011, 10:43 PM

[David O'Leary]

David, thanks for helping present an angle from the viewpoint of some affected professionals.

My pleaseure, it was a good one to write, one of my favourites that I've done actually.

[Mark Ellis]

Good opinion article by Jim MacQuarrie, focused on Granito's possible tactics of his stretching the truth.

http://www.tasteslikecomics.com/2011/03/do...uy-rob-granito/

Jim is dead-on when he describes Granito as displaying textbook Narcissistic Personality Disorder characteristics, but the guy is obviously a sociopath...a street corner diagnosis made because of his inability to connect actions and consequences, as well as the classic sociopathic assumption that he's smarter than everyone else.

[Ringtail Cafe]

I'm probably going to seem like the bad guy here, but I want to remind everyone: Don't play into what he wants. He WANTS attention. He wants infamy. He wants to become "well known" by having done absolutely nothing at all.

Don't make that happen. As soon as you start stringing someone up and making an example of them, you make them a spectacle. You make them famous. This kind of behavior deserves a disdainful shake of the head, and a passing on of information to other parties it might affect. Don't make him the center of attention because frankly...he's won.

How many people here don't know (insert indy artist of legitimate talent and methods here), but now instantly know this guy because everyone is screaming his name?

[Mark Ellis]

He wants to become "well known" by having done absolutely nothing at all.

Agreed...but I'm less curious about the guy's motivations--which are transparent--than the methods by which he got away with the whole thing for so long.

I read Douglas Doug Paszkiewicz's interesting opinion post about Granito (http://arseniclullabies.com/wordpress/?p=89) and found this bit relevant to my own fairly recent experiences:

"I don’t know what’s wrong with everyone else’s self esteem but i personally take offense to, after ten years of hard work to get where i am, being categorized and placed in the same section as some dopey kid with kinkos made comics and 40 year old goof balls who want to play “artist” one week out of the year."

The implication is that the "Artist's Alley" practice is partially culpable and I think there's something to that.

There's always been kind of of a "Con Caste System", but during my heyday of attending conventions as a guest--late 80s through the early 90s--the professionals were scattered throughout the main floor. Even the last Dragon Con I attended in 1994, my table was sandwiched between Tony Harris and Adam Hughes.

Apparently, as far as the con organizers were concerned my professional credentials were sufficiently professional. That's the way it had been at all the other Dragon Cons and conventions I had attended as a guest during the previous three or four years.

A couple of years ago, shortly after the release of The Everything Guide to Writing Graphic Novels, my wife and co-author Melissa attended a Boston convention in order to promote the book.

In case people aren't familiar with it it, the book was produced by Adams Media, one of the largest commercial non-fiction publishers in the world and the parent company that owns Comic Buyer's Guide.

This was my first comic convention in well over a dozen years.

Once we arrived at the venue, we found ourselves shunted off to a room segregated from the main convention floor, stuck at a table surrounded by exactly the kind of “artists” Doug describes in his quote.

Although there were a couple of professional artists there, they were definitely outnumbered by the ash-canners and amateurs selling their Sharpie-rendered portraits of Wolverine.

Almost no one entered that room...until Herb Trimpe made his appearance, setting up at a table at the far end. The people who wanted him to sign comics and such trooped in and queued up in a single file, resolutely not making eye contact with those of us occupying tables on either side of them.

I felt more like we were in a leper's ward than an Artist's Alley.

We sold one book. It cost us about 80 bucks to attend the con, factoring in gas, parking and time.

So, it strikes me that the Granitos wouldn't be so inclined to flourish if they were out there in the general convention population instead of being stuck either in a seperate room or an isolated section of the venue.

I'm guessing the Artist's Alley practice became commonplace when con organizers decided to treat Big Name Pros like visiting royalty or rock stars, but there's a vast divide between Big Name Pros and the wannabes, the never-wases and the outright delusional frauds.

In fact, the majority of working professionals in the comics field fill that divide.

I have some upcoming comics projects that I'd like to promote at conventions--like The Justice Machine--but if I'm going be exiled to some Loser's Limbo, I'll just take a pass.

This post has been edited by Mark Ellis: Apr 1 2011, 07:32 AM

[Cary]

I've resisted railing on Granito because honestly it's beating a dead horse. This new Artist's Alley rant though...needs some discussion. I agree they need to select out the mini-comic producing ash can people, and that's fine. But Webcomics people have a very real right to be there showing off their stuff and networking with fans. I'd say that convention organizers do need to start screening the people they give tables to in Artist's Alley, but by the same token there has to be some allowance made for people just starting out. Everyone has to have their first convention sometime.

[Mark Ellis]

I'd say that convention organizers do need to start screening the people they give tables to in Artist's Alley, but by the same token there has to be some allowance made for people just starting out. Everyone has to have their first convention sometime.

True enough...but it seems to me that the whole Artist's Alley approach is far more problematical than actually helpful.

Obviously at the Boston con I mention, that approach didn't work for anybody....defnitely not the web or mini-comic producers.

The con organizers should just stop it and let the pros be scattered about the main floor like in the good ol' days instead of being segregated.

Judging by what I learned later, most convention attendees view the Artist's Alleys as Amateur Alleys and therefore, places to be avoided.

Frankly, it's ridiculous and insulting to put seasoned professionals with years worth of commecial credentials between a couple of 20 somethings trying to sell their self-published autobiographical mini-comics.

This post has been edited by Mark Ellis: Apr 1 2011, 12:04 PM

[Detroit Fanfare]

It seems in recent years, the Artist Alley section is what is driving many conventions. At our first con, we put all the creators around the perimeter so they had the wall space and the vendors were in the center. It seemed to keep a flow with all the creators and fans stayed in the room for a long time so we quickly became overwhelmed with the crowd. Hence, the move to increase our space 6 fold.

This year, we have to construct the con in a more traditional way but we still are driving the focus to the creators. Upon entering the hall, the publishers are fist, then the creators, then the vendors, and at the back will be the media guests as well as the food court. We've found that it seems the creators are what most of the people spend their time at although vendors of course, still have their dedicated base.

It seems, based on our con and C2E2 to name just two, more and more attention is shifting towards the creators...of all kinds...and that's a good thing.

[Mark Ellis]

It seems, based on our con and C2E2 to name just two, more and more attention is shifting towards the creators...of all kinds...and that's a good thing.

Yeah...that's why segregating and cramming 'em all together in one room or area (except the Big Name Guests) seems counter-productive.

[Cary]

I'm not really sure how that's counterproductive though. I mean consider the C2E2 show recently past. You had Indie people tabled up right next to big names, and it all went down just fine. I was personally glad I wasn't tabled next to someone completely HUGE because the lines those guys were generating were pretty much log jamming the aisles where they were, but I would have gotten over it had I been placed next to someone like that. I mean what you've got then is a captive audience to pitch at and talk to! People come into Artist's Alley to see what's new, and what everyone has to offer, not to mention to get clear of the madness in the main floor and get some one on one time with the bigger name creators. I don't see how having them interspersed amongst the alley at large does anything but help everyone by driving traffic around the floor. If you had a room full of people no one had ever heard of you wouldn't get much traffic in that room, you know?

[Mark Ellis]

I don't see how having them interspersed amongst the alley at large does anything but help everyone by driving traffic around the floor. If you had a room full of people no one had ever heard of you wouldn't get much traffic in that room, you know?

That's the point.

We were segregated completely and I was told later that practice had become more and more common.

What I posted:

"Almost no one entered that room...until Herb Trimpe made his appearance, setting up at a table at the far end. The people who wanted him to sign comics and such trooped in and queued up in a single file, resolutely not making eye contact with those of us occupying tables on either side of them. "

Nobody knew whether they had heard of the people before because "Almost no one entered that room."

If I had been on the main floor, with some 20 something ash-canner at the table next to me and someone better known on the either side, that's fine.

But by categorizing and isolating every creator--the known, the unknown, the poseurs, the amatuers, the pros, the halt and the lame--into a single seperate space, the message and the outcome was very clear.

Couterproductive.

This post has been edited by Mark Ellis: Apr 3 2011, 08:52 AM

[Cary]

If I had been on the main floor, with some 20 something ash-canner at the table next to me and someone better known on the either side, that's fine.

But by categorizing and isolating every creator--the known, the unknown, the poseurs, the amatuers, the pros, the halt and the lame--into a single seperate space, the message and the outcome was very clear.

Couterproductive.

Ok, I guess what I didn't understand was you guys were segregated from the rest of the SHOW into your own room then? That's crazy. You'll get half the show that doesn't even know there IS a second room! Yeah I'd be pissed about that no doubt.

I actually like the way the Artist Alley set up works at the big shows I've been to. The one at New Orleans this year was actually really cool because people had to come through Artist's Alley to get to the food! That was a nice little set up there and it made for a ton of traffic through the alley.

[Mark Ellis]

Speaking only for myself...

I possess neither the time, the inclination or the resources to go hallooing off to every convention within a 200 mile radius on my own dime.

I have to make a judgement call on whether or not attending a con is going to have a payoff, either in networking or sales of product. So, if I glance over a list of the occupants of an Artists Alley where I'll set up and see more names that I don't recognize than ones I do, it doesn't seem like a wise investment.

Counterproductive, in other words.

At the Boston show, if I had been told the Artist Alley was in reality an isolation ward I would definitely not have bothered with it.

[Louis Bright-Rav...]

Mark:

I possess neither the time, the inclination or the resources to go hallooing off to every convention within a 200 mile radius on my own dime.

Especially when half of them want $200-$500 from you to have your table so you can be subjected to the abuse that fandom dishes out.

[Mark Ellis]

I will say I wasn't charged for the table space.

I really would've been pissed instead of just a combination of irritation and bewilderment.

Er...if you're a professional creator with substantial credentials, why would con organizers charge you? You'd be a draw.

I guess a lot has changed with conventions since the 90s.

[Louis Bright-Rav...]

It's all political nowdays, Mark. For example, I just talked to Sheldon - the guy who runs Heroes Con - not two weeks ago he wants me to pay $300 for a spot because as you say I'm "not enough of a draw". He's seen me at the one-day Charlotte show he doesn't run about ten times and has watched me outsell the 'name' talents. He knows perfectly goddamned well I'm marketable to his fanbase.

As for credits, I've worked for Arrow Comics, Ronin Studios, Steve Jackson Games, TSR / Wizards of the Coast... but I've never been at Marvel or DC making him big bucks on mainstream comics sales, so I'm not 'name' enough for free space. Meanwhile, the local artists he's buddies with who have never worked on anything professional in their lives period have free space. Even though I'd have to drive 90 miles one way to the show, pay for hotel that has to be handicapped accessible to accomodate my two disabled parents because I can't leave them alone the entire weekend with no transportation in the event of an emergency, board my cat for the weekend or find a hotel that's also pet friendly, etc. I have so many extra expenditures to consider, and the ass wants to give the nobody who's never even been published and can sleep in their own bed and does not have to pay for meals and other expenditures free table space because what, they do store sit-ins on Free Comic Book Day? They buy their comics at his comics shop?

Screw that. If anything I'll be up the road at the SF Convention that takes place the same weekend.