John Wilson's latest column: http://comicrelated.com/news/16700/indy-comics

It has already sparked a lot of conversation in the comments section.

Apologies this will be a scatterbrained reply. . .

How many of the people you interviewed were new to the industry? There's a good chance less experienced artists / creators will be awkward out of the gate.

There's also the sad reality that a lot of creators / artists are folks who may not be overly social.

As far as doing commissions of "popular" characters goes, I feel we need to embrace this. This exists in the Japanese market in the form of Comiket a Japanese fan comic convention. This is where comic fans come together and sell their works, often based off of popular comics, video games, or animated series (sometimes pornographic) and attendance (as of 2009) was 560,000 people. For a fan comic convention. Obviously this number is skewed with 40% of printed materials in Japan being comics.

Why is Comiket important? Because it gives creators an outlet for their work, and exposes their body of work to the competitive publishing market in Japan. It's not uncommon for an artist to start in a doujinshi circle (fan comic studio) and work their way into the industry.

So in that regard, I don't feel that it's a bad idea for new creators to garner fan attention by drawing Black Cat or Spiderman. If that's what the fans want, give it to them. However you could do the Dave Sim / Dave Peterson model and draw your characters (Cerebus / Mouse guard) as those corporate icons. This gives the fans what they want (Spiderman) while promoting your work (Cerebus).

It's an interesting article and I can see the failing of the fledgling creators at Heroes, Mid Ohio, and Pittsburgh conventions. Just walk down artists alley and see how many creators strike up a conversation at an empty table. In addition to being wildly talented, you need to be able to work a crowd or have someone at your table who can draw a crowd to your table.

One of my favorites is a team of African American creators who attend Mid Ohio Con. They have someone who is something of an M.C. / Carnival Barker to draw attention to their table. They would hold these quick draw competitions and have the spectators who gathered around vote on the winner, etc. They put on a hell of a show.

If people don't know who you are, and you don't put yourself out there for them to find out, then we'll never know.

If someone is wandering through artists alley you need to be able to lure them to your table. Free swag. Interesting conversation. Something. You can't be a bump on a log.

If I had to boil it down to one single thing Indie creators fail at, this would be it. Most people assume, quite incorrectly, that when the book is done, so is the journey, when in fact it's quite the opposite. It really drives me crazy to walk by someone's table and find them staring at their art board rather than up bouncing around actually selling the books and other product, or hell even pitching the book! One thing everyone who has ever been near my table at a convention can say is that I'm relentless when it comes to pitching people on the books. If I have an artist at the table, they'll be good to draw all they want because I'm there selling away. For one man teams that might seem harder, but hell take your wife, your sister, your girlfriend, whatever! Take SOMEONE who can do the business portion, because if you don't you just wasted your time and money attending a show that could have truly been successful.

In Facebook terms, 'LIKE'.

I tried bringing my wife, girlfriend, and mistress with me on a shopping trip once. Hoo boy, they did not get along.

Yes, sadly, the product is only half the battle. In some cases, books have the advantage over comic books, in that they have a far more prevalent promotional source. Nearly every shop around the corner has a bookstand. So everyone can spot a book that interests them. Even the cover alone will get them.

But comics...well, that is a far greater battle. There is the conventions, the shops, the web etc, but even then, it dos not guarantee sales. One an always go for a publisher to publish their comci, but again, that does not guarantee sales either. And then they can easily be exploited. Just harken back to Solson, among others, who published comic books that required those creating the comics to publish the work. To say they were exploited would be like saying snow is white. Solson did little to any promotional work, just putting out a truck load of bog standard comic books.
Sad but true.
Yet, one may think that these kinds of things no longer happen. The sad thing is, that with the internet, these things will probably become far more prevalent than we can imagine.

There are aspects of the big two that really annoy me, as well as aspects of the others that also annoy me. Image and Dark Horse don't do half the promotional crap as the big two, yet they also do not garner as much attention either. Maybe Kirkman may try and rectify this, since, as a writer, he knows that art will not sell the book, nor will it keep people coming back either. But promotion is often the untapped vein that many folks need to try and get good at, and Kirman, whether in interviews or advice, often goes out of his way to talk with folks about his groups. Compare that to the other Image guys, who do one interview every few years.

There are people out there who sell themselves like a pimp, and get the paychecks to prove it too. Jim Lee is a guy who knows, full well, that even as a working professional, he cannot allow himself to relax, as the next guy will take his job.
Some creators are compensating for this by setting up blogs, communicating with fans, and so forth. Not only does it allow one to promote their work, or get additional jobs, but they can establish relationships with folks who may be able to get them their next gig.
These can backfire somewhat, such as the Scott McDaniel v John Rozum, or the other way around, where both of them had a creative meltdown behind the scenes of the book, and ultimately the title, Static Shock, died. Yet the sad element behind it was that both individuals decided to air their dirty laundry in public, rather than keeping it private.

One artist who has a dedicated fan following, is Barry Kitson, a very talented penciller and all round nice guy. When people queue to get a sketch from him, they don't pay a dime. The only payment they have to give is their time (and a dedication, which he writes on the drawing). Again, clever promotion.

Say whaaaat?!

Art absolutely sells comics. This is how guys like Adam Hughes maintain careers in the industry.

You put a page of words in Previews and put a page with a sweet pin-up in Previews and watch which page viewers stop on. This is why most of the bigger publishers have gigantic full color pinups to hawk their wares.

Crazy talk sir.

Crazy talk.

Art sells it, but I would argue it does not keep people coming back. Jeph Loeb has had a truck load of talented artists working with him on books, such as Ultimatum, or Ultimates v3, but examining the sales shows one thing. They don't stay there. They actually flee very quickly.

Same thing for many other books. Chuck Austen, tons of talented artists, but they, the readers, run to the hills after a few issues. Hence why he cannot get a job in comics anymore.

Adam Hughes is a talented artist, and has a long and varied career. But he mainly does covers, now, very few sequential pages anymore. Again, do folks stick around with just the covers?
However, he is drawing one of the before Watchmen books, but opinions are divided over that series. Whether fans will buy it or not is an issue.
Also, this may never come out either, as his last announced book, Wonder Woman, never materialised, and this was years before JMS had his run on the book.

Also, remember that not too recently, I believe last year, Hughes stated that he would not be doing commissions any more, because people were selling the commissions for massive money. Well that was just terrible business on his part. Which is another thing that catches comics folks too. That may have damaged his standing in the comics community, as other artists, knowing the way the economy is now, would not do anything so silly.

This is splitting comics into factions that I don't agree with. Comics are the synergy of word and pictures. If you remove a good story or cool to look at art from the equation the book doesn't work. Grant Morrison's run on X-Men is a fine example. Everybody raves about the book, but I cannot stomach Frank Quietly's art. I'd rather read that run as a novel rather than contend with that art.

Kirkman is a good example. I haven't read anything by the guy that has resonated with me. Walking Dead was okay, but when Tony Moore left so did I, and it was probably just convenience as I wasn't thrilled by the story. So mediocre story and mediocre art = no sale.

Loeb's Hulk run consistently sold around 40k copies a month. Now Hulk sells 22k copies a month, and it's more "critically acclaimed" than the Loeb run. The problem here is Parker's great ideas are killed by middling quality art. No offense to working professionals, but there are a lot of people working in this industry who sap all the fun and dynamism out of a title. Hulk is the perfect example of this. At this point I'd rather read a novelization of Parker's Hulk run than contend with boring ass art. You can't lead with Ed McGuiness, Arthur Adams, Frank Cho, and an artistically redeemed Ian Churchill then tag off to artistic bench warmers.

I can't speak for Ultimatum as I've always viewed the Ultimate universe as redundant garbage. Hey, let's not make new characters! Let's just warm over existing characters. The New Universe line had more creative integrity than the Ultimate line. So the slow unceremonious end to that line as titles drop off and ideas from it are melded into mainstream continuity is high comedy.

The words and pictures need to work in unison, otherwise it's not good comics.



I don't know if they stick around for the covers. I'm not a guy that pays $3-4 for a cover, but Hughes and others commonly give panels at conventions on the importance of a good cover to sell a comic. Perhaps this is why DC sticks Hughes on middle / low tier character covers, to bolster sales through drawing attention on the rack.



Hughes drawing Before Watchmen is more damning for me than him being butthurt over con sketch reselling. He's been incredibly vocal about how much of a pain doing interiors is, and how little it pays, thus he does cover work and skips on projects like All Star Wonder Woman. You'll notice he changes his tune when Warner Bros. backs up a Brinks truck to his front door to stick it to Alan Moore.

The only way I can reconcile my newfound distaste for Adam "Wah Wah" Hughes is if he is using Before Watchmen interiors as a warm up to do All Star Wonder Woman interiors.

Although I can understand. When you're doing work for hire in America and have no health insurance, benefits, or retirement plan - you need every penny you can get. So people reselling your con sketches hurts when you look at it that way. Nevermind all the fans you're leaving out in the cold.

Back on topic - indy creators need to have eye catching banners at their tables. I noticed pros at Heroes Con who had no banners or branding at their tables. It was easier to spot Johnny Nobody due to good self promotion over guys like Mike Zeck, Walter Simonson, and Tom Raney. All artists whose work I love, but without the con mini-map you would never find them!

To the point of John's article;

I can vouch for Heroes Con having mostly fanart and commission work at most of the tables. The main reason this has occurred is because artists have realized that the best way to make money from conventions is to do fanart. Why bother spending several months slaving over sequential pages when you can draw an 11x17 picture of Batman or Legend of Korra and make far more money? Because they want to draw for Marvel or DC one day and the better option is to go the sequential route? Not really. John Doe artist grew up wanting to draw Superman. Now he gets to go to a comic convention and draw Superman all day for money and exposure. That's way more fun than drawing a no-name creator owned title that has a very good chance of going nowhere.

It also simply makes way more sense. Not only to the artist, but the family that is supporting the artist. My wife for example only cares about two things when I'm leaving the show; 1. Am I safe. 2. How much money did I make. If I'm not making enough money at a show, my wife and I sit back and decide whether or not that show is worth doing any more. If I have a string of bad shows, my wife and I decide whether its a good idea to do any more shows period. When I have good-great shows, that gives me another 6 months on the convention trail. It allows me to continue doing this instead of getting a "real" job. I can only imagine that other married artists, or artists with families are in a similar situation.

Compounding this issue is the fans themselves. At Derby City this passed Saturday, I literally had teen-aged girls jumping for joy because I had a Legend of Korra picture flanked with posters from Full Metal Alchemist. I guess I was the only person in the entire show that had done fanart for the new Avatar series, and I really benefited from that. Those happy customers showed my work to others at the show, and they in turn came to my table and picked up MORE fanart from me. In the end, I had one of the highest single day totals I've ever experienced since I started attending conventions. Now please keep in mind, I do have original work in my portfolio. I have a good 7-8 Psychic Soldier Kai prints in there, and its mixed in with the fanart. The thing is no one ever buys any of it. No one even asked about it. So I can see why some don't even bother doing it in the first place. Why waste your time doing a pic of your character when you can do a pic of a popular character and make lots of money off of it.

And that's really why most of us go to these shows; To make money. Let's not kid ourselves here. We can pretend that we're trying to perform some lofty goal or some reach some philosophical high point, but in the end, we're all just chasing the all-mighty dollar. That's why John saw so many guys at Heroes Con with fanart at their table, and why you're going to see less indie comics at conventions moving forward. A lot more artists know the secret now, and they're going to do everything in their power to try to grab a piece of the money pie.

Mason, I think there's a difference between those who do it for the love of the medium and hope to make a few bucks at it as compared to those that do it just for the money. It doesn't have to be "some lofty goal or some reach some philosophical high point" as you put it, but that doesn't mean there are creators that make comics just because they love them.

Now as for me, I do hope to make a good living working in comics, but if I didn't love the medium I wouldn't even bother. So I guess I'm somewhere in the middle. I make a living at them now, but it's a VERY modest living (and hard one at that, that far too often falls short), and I do go to cons hoping to sell books and stuff. But I also go to spread the word of my comic that I love enough to put my heart and soul into.

In short, as far as that sub-topic is concerned, I don't think it's an either/or situation, nor do I think it's always all about the dollar.

You appear to have an Albatross around your neck Mason.

People buy your artwork.

People respond positively to work you do of characters they like.

People don't respond to Psychic Soldier Kai.

Have you stopped to ask yourself why that is?

Psychic Soldier Kai has become an albatross around your neck that you're letting reinforce your negative opinion of comic fans. Your deviantart page doesn't have any recent Kai stuff. The webcomic hasn't been updated in nine months. You're not a captain at sea. There's no need to go down with this ship.

The cream always rises to the top.

Clearly people enjoy your artwork, but they aren't responding favorably to PSK. PSK can't be the only idea you have. Instead of wasting your time designing X-Men characters that will never be X-Men, take those characters you're designing and put them to work for you in your own book. Maybe people will respond more positively to that book.

I like buying cool new comics from guys in the indie alley, and yes I'm guilty of putting their talents to use drawing Marvel/DC/Image characters for me; but the next time I see them I have them draw my favorite character from their series along with another character.

At Heroes Con I found postcards for neat indie comics laying on the table near the registration booth. I picked up the ones that caught my eye, went into the show, and bought the books.

Think about it. Being mad at people that don't know who you and PSK are at conventions isn't the answer.

The short version courtesy of Adam Carolla:

Does it make you money or does it make you happy?

If it doesn't do either of these things, it's time to move on.

Brant, I have no doubt that there are guys who do comics for personal reasons. With that said, I just can't imagine that being applied to the convention circuit. People getting tables at conventions are there to spread their brand (to make more money) and sell stuff to people. I have yet to see a creator offering nothing but free stuff at their table. The vast majority of people at cons are there to sell something to someone.




This is a pretty strange post from you Greg, and I really don't know how you could have gleaned any of that from my response to this topic.

However since you brought all of this up, I'll go ahead and respond to it;

1. I disagree that PSK is/was an albatross. In fact, I've been more successful since I put PSK on hiatus. I do wish to finish the series at some point though.
2. I understand fully why people don't respond to Kai and people respond to fanart. That was the point of my post really, because it partially explains why John saw an artist alley full of fanart as opposed to an artist alley full of indie comics.
3. I'm not angry or bitter at comic fans. Quite the opposite in fact.
4. I definitely do have other ideas for comics in mind.

I'm glad that you purchase indie comics. If more con-goers were like you, maybe we'd see a better balance between indies and fanart. For better of for worse, you're going to be seeing the dominance of fanart in Artist Alley for many years to come. ESPECIALLY as table prices rise.